look one last point
Im an it person of 25+ years who runs SAAS company, i can estimate unit economics of task of manually converting token. 15-20 minutes MAX of time spend, NOT SPAN FROM OPEN TO CLOSE (LENGHT) but TIME SPENT!
Solution A: bunch them together = > process them 1 time per 1/2/4 weeks
Solution B: charge fee/tax for it(small but enough to cover the cost) say 5% tax, $10 min.
If you dont have resources = hire them, u can afford it, huge war chest of stolen money.
problem is gone… if you continue to BS us about these topics i will make them public for future investors, which will be less and less with every 10 tweets/posts/retweets and every youtube videos that will come out.
Unless of course its not the goal of the project to gain size, u just want to wind this shit down, to yet next epic failure/rebranding, to see more people fall off, so u can inflate your tiny share to feel even more significant…
Cause honestly thats exactly all you’re doing by comments like this
Have a very good reason why migrations have to be reopened. This reason has to be so pertinent that it would convince people to give up their selfish desires and lower their current token backing.
Seriously, WERE ALL THESE PEOPLE RAISED BY WOLFES? THEY DID NOT HAVE PARENTS TEACHING THEM TAKING WHATS NOT YOURS WITHOUT THEIR KNOWLEGE AND AGREEMENT IS THEFT!?
WTF ! WHO DO U REALLY THING U TALKING TO HERE, are u even human?
Wonderland investors group consisted of different folks, of differnt backgrounds, professions, levels of intelegence.
I’ve been in IT,since the time, im sure u were running under the table sucking on momys titty, but I DID NOT HAVE FULL UNDERSTANDING of VOLTA CLUB MIGRATION, Im not talking about deadline, that I was not aware of,we’ve established the fake vote illigimacy and failure to comunicate, so different point.
i was not 100% unless i needed to spent hours more of time catching up/figuring out.
I thogh maybe its another BetsWapp deal, where i have to proof that i have WMEMO to get some new tockens at first, then in november before holidays, i spent some more time reading and it was more clear still not 100% thats the deal, i had to invest even more time…
So u’re basically take peoples $
U HOLD THEM
U DECIDE TO DO SOMTHING = which TRANSALTES into people having to jump through hoops(TIME WASTE) and u expect them to do it yesterday, or think that 150 days is enough
noitice the pattern = U
U decided all these things, YOUR TEAM NEVER POLLED the REAL WORLD OF WMEMO investors to validate THESE FALSE ASSUMPTIONS!
so again, u can get offended all u want.
I am still convinced that YOUR TEAM IS IN ON THE SCAM!
Other choices: Dumb, Incompetent…> thats all you get from me at this point.
Look again why are we talking in this god forsaken forum that noone sees? Why the top Gs of the project not publicly addressing the issue? why not hosting ama?
Answer is very obvious and simple…
From what I can understand, the biggest problem is that the team didn’t communicate properly. As a result, all other teams have failed, since if the team had communicated properly, there wouldn’t have been an issue. Please correct me if I am wrong on that.
I am on the opinion that the team did do all they could.
The team isn’t responsible for the number of engagements and, therefore, the number of users who have seen the tweets. If we look at many big and important Twitter accounts, we can see that the views can be worse off than the official Wonderland Twitter.
I will leave 3 examples of random twitter accounts and random tweets:
Also, if you look back at old tweets, there isn’t much of a difference in the views compared to now. As pointed out with much larger brand accounts, the number of followers isn’t representative of who will view the tweet.
Another example is the Time token. Currently, on Avalanche, there are 34k holders. What about them? What about all the time they had to convert to Memo? What about Memo holders who didn’t wrap? There are 310k holders on Avalanche. Why don’t you say the team failed them as well?
While I do agree that there are areas where the team is lacking, I completely disagree that the team has failed its holders. At the end of the day, you are responsible for your investments. “Stake and chill” works until something happens. Also, I am not sure if it is you, but someone with the same views did acknowledge they saw there was a migration, but at the time, there wasn’t a deadline, and they chose not to do anything. Not even check for 2 minutes.
I don’t think comparing an URGENT need for people to transfer their wallets/money close to $100 million to a new token is quite comparable to the BBC putting up a Tweet about a David Attenborough TV show or other completely trivial Tweets. I would compare such a Tweet and the others you have inserted more like the GIFs and yacht party Tweets by the Twitter page of this DAO.
And again, my issue as I have tried to explain to the team is not about the number of views of the tweets, it’s KNOWING you are getting low views which clearly means not enough people are viewing your tweets so in order to get more views you need more volume of tweets, understand?
If I post once and get 8,000 views and that’s it for a month, then views for the month = 8,000
If I post 10 times about something in a month it’s 10 x 8,000 = 80,000 views and a greater spread of people within that 80,000
Posting once is not enough, this is exactly what Djinn did he posted 3 times with 5 days to go with urgent and the #Wonderland in his tweet but the guy has like 60 followers so it’s not going to be enough.
The team simultaneously talks about doing everything they can in terms of communication while “not hyping” the DAO. I don’t see how they can run together. Back when this started, Wonderland was pretty much built on a guy (like him or not) who was a marketer. Dani communicated non-stop about the frogs everyday (volume of views). The page could be silent more or less and just follow with the basic announcements similar to what’s posted on the Discord. Now without a member like that the team needs to be more public to get these projects over the line and that is what they are, projects (rebrand and migration of thousands of holders).
And you are correct I did see a note about migrations, but nothing about deadlines even after the migration deadline was imposed, so there’s a mistake on my side, happy to admit 100%, but why does the team not even acknowledge that things were not on point from their side too? No one has referred to my post about WIP #32, is it just something to wipe your ass with or is it there to determine if the team is performing well or not?
Jigsaw-puzzle communication. There’s a standard WIP #32 that a team is held to in order to take a few million dollars from this fund, why can they not be questioned when they don’t get some very basic things right and just absolve themselves of any mistakes. My opening post about is about the team and how they ran the project (new brand and migration), the numbers that they converted speaks for themselves, their project failed, so what they just carry on? Do you honestly think not even mentioning that “Wonderland is now Volta” on Twitter in the last few months is acceptable? It seems rooted in the idea of “not hyping”. There’s thousands of holders, that requires hype unfortunately, go make a new fund if that’s what you’d prefer. Well now there kind of is one, but 73% of it was taken from previous holders so yeah, little hype, new fund, successful job by the team (or at least one member of it)
The mark of people absolving themselves of a problem they created is not acknowledging they have a large part of it and not coming up with any possible solutions. As a result, because I do not see them coming up with anything and I don’t see a vote by the 27% of migrated holders coming up the only way I think it’s solved is if a new team comes into place who’s interest is in all token holders, communicates well across the board and acknowledges mistakes, and is interested in growing the fund AND hyping the project, in other words marketing it. This team went and created a project and a new governance token without a vote, created problems from their way of delivering the project and now lost 73% of holders, I don’t see why they should continue to be honest.
Seems to be a lot of going in circles, so let’s focus on what’s missing from this NCV proposal.
If the vote is posted and passes, then what ? Who handles the post no-confidence work? How do we get back on track as a protocol ? Who will put in place the will of the DAO if there is no one left ?
We’ve voted on proposals in the past that were lacking in similar details and it came back to haunt us. Let’s say everyone agrees the team should be fired, we would need a plan to keep moving forward. Otherwise, this is more or less a wind down vote and no one is going to be better off.
On the other hand, if there’s a NCV and the result is to keep the team. Then what ? Migration is still over. All these issues become irrelevant ? People still lost money. I guess it could serve as potential feedback for the future decisions.
But no problems were fixed.
I’m honestly not sure how actionable this vote is. In it’s current state, one way or the other, the DAO and the community doesn’t get out of it in a better shape.
@NalX thanks for your reply and it’s pretty much what I would like to see from the team, opening a dialogue about a proposal, discussing parts that might be missing and how it could be improved.
It’s rather unfortunate that there were zero similar comments, such as what’s missing, future problems etc. posted under the “End of Migrations” vote and forum post from a member of the team despite the team saying they would continue migrations. [CMP #1] - End of Manual Migrations - #15 by tonicrt
So you are correct, previous votes have come back to haunt the protocol due to lacking details.
Around what would be done I would be open to the suggestion that each department would see a vote to be honest. I am sure there are ways which members would be more positively looked at than others so perhaps not a full wipe out would be needed. I think it could serve as an important step reputationally for the “rebrand” and a clear view as to what would be deemed acceptable or not from team members, otherwise what is WIP #32 for?
Open to suggestions and proposals on a full team NCV and what would be needed.
I have praised certain team members, I do not know their official role but people like Djinn clearly seemed to understand the urgency around the migration more than others from his Twitter. I would be of the opinion that an interim team made up with people like him could take on the rebuild if a full NCV was to proceed and go through and attempt to learn from mistakes and build a better Wonderland/Volta from all of this.
While I understand what you mean (I think at least), it seems a bit weird to ask the team members, as a group or individually, to start a discussion around the plan to fire themselves
I guess the first question is, is this meant to be a real NCV or more of a “conversation starter” ?
If this post is meant as a discussion to expose some issues and have discussions around potential improvements for each departments/lack of faith in an officer’s competence, then it would have to be a lot more detailed imo. For example, while your post included some of the issues with the department, it doesn’t really talk about the positive things that department has done (if nothing, then you can say that too) and maybe how it could/should have been done better based on w/e WIP #32 says or something else.
If this post is meant to be an actual NCV, then we need you or whoever is willing to help you to set the stage for all of it. And while the team help/participate in the conversation/planning, the proposal should also not expect the team them too. Most people would not be a fan of getting fired from your boss, but having to keep doing the job for X amount of time while they figure out what to do
Splitting it would probably easier either way, but it also doesn’t mean one would not resign even if they are not part of the NCV given the situation.
Team members/titles can be found in WIP #32here, excluding Me/Compliance Officer since Feb 2023. The rest who help out like Djinn and hypermassiv, etc. are mainly moderators.
Honestly, from me it is a NCV proposal based on WIP #32 and what each department have done with the project. It’s like everything, we are all judged in our work by a role and how that’s implemented when needed.
If I look at WIP #32 and I compare it to what I think has happened in 2023 then I don’t think the team performed by it, I won’t write out my long paragraphs again for each department but those are my reasons (opening post) and I stand by them. If WIP #32 talks so much about the fund being legally aligned etc, then I think anything that is to be judged by that standard would say that in review of the Wonderland performance for 2023 and with what the team had to deal with, how they did it was not acceptable.
I view the CMP #1 vote as the result of the teams work, I don’t see how it doesn’t cause widespread panic within the team to do everything to avoid the vote if they are to be judged by WIP #32 and being compliant with legal standards. I understand that a DAO vote means you have to follow it, but some DAO votes can be caused by the direction the team is taking the DAO. How the team delivered the project meant the direction of Wonderland/Volta for the foreseeable future and ultimately led to that vote, so the team is at the root of that vote and then the team sponsored and voted yes.
If instead back in August, Wonderland was hacked and 73% of wMEMO burned in the hack but the fund remained with just 27% of tokens left I think the team would be doing everything possible to save all token holders. To me this is the same, all or none. To some people they may just check back on Wonderland after months to see where it is but at the end of the day they trusted the people they were investing in on day one. I get it when it’s said “that’s crypto learn your lesson” but you don’t need the people you bought into and trusted to tell you that (while they basically have just taken on your holdings), especially people who are trying to apply legal standards and bringing standards like WIP #32 into place.
As per WIP #32, teams can have an internal vote on other members. If there really is division in the team on migrations, the vote and its sponsorship and outcome then I don’t see why that is not already in use and struggle to see what standards the team are actually holding themselves to also. While everyone has a right to do whatever they want there’s a standard you have to expect.
I would hope more suggestions will come in around how a NCV could work. Is there a protocol in place for what happens if the team does get voted out? If it can’t happen well then maybe that’s feedback for the governance of this DAO. How many people can actually now sponsor a vote?
Hi wMEMOholder, thank you for taking the time to draft out such a detailed post with feedback for the team. I personally will only address the subject of “Communication” with you, and respond to the points you mentioned.
When the rebranding initially launched, it was tweeted by the official Wonderland Twitter account. We conscientiously chose not to update the name, icon, etc. of our social media pages immediately at the time of the post, wanting to allow time for users to see the post under the familiar username and profile picture/banner so there would be no confusion. The social media rebranding did not occur until many days later, so that it would be clear who the information was coming from under the original “Wonderland” account.
Any followers who did not check in during this transition window, would be able to easily see all prior history of the account to quickly ascertain that Volta Club is Wonderland, as we did not switch to a new account for this specific reason. This makes it easier for even those who do not stay up to date regularly, to figure out what they missed, when they see updates coming from an account they already follow.
I would like to point out that Communications were not limited to “one tweet per month”. Since the migration window opened in late August, there have been 30 posts on our Twitter account. While we do not post daily because that would be a nuisance for our community, our social media accounts are by no means inactive. Every tweet, regardless of the content, draws eyes to our account, where the important messages relating to migration were pinned and highlighted, increasing the total viewership.
When the migration and rebranding first began, with no deadline in sight, it was announced on our Discord server, Twitter, Reddit, and an article was released under our Medium publication as well. The Wonderland website was updated with a banner announcing the migration and rebranding and linking to the new website. The token listings for wMEMO on CoinGecko, CoinMarketCap, DeBank, etc were all informed by our tech officer about the switch to the new token and those platforms assisted us with putting a banner on their pages for wMEMO announcing the migration.
When there was one week remaining to use the migration portal on our dapp, before switching to manual migrations, a reminder was sent out across Discord, Twitter, Reddit, and our official DeBank account stream, which is our newest social media account.
When the migration portal on our dapp closed and migrations were only available manually via assistance from the team, this was communicated on Discord, Twitter, Reddit, and DeBank account. The former Wonderland website was set to auto-redirect to Volta Club at this time as scammers were trying to steal the opportunity to clone and scam people with a fake migration portal. The new Volta website had a banner at the top stating that the migration portal had closed and to reach out to the team on Discord for assistance migrating.
A reminder about the vote 24 hours before closing was also posted on Discord and Twitter.
When the vote concluded, the results of the vote and subsequent new deadline were communicated immediately across Discord, Twitter, Reddit, and our DeBank account. This message was pinned to the top of our feed and highlighted on our account as well. A banner was posted to the top of our governance forum with the CMP #1 results and subsequent migration deadline.
One week before the voted deadline for manual migrations, a reminder was once again posted on Discord, Twitter, Reddit, and DeBank, and this new reminder was once again added to our Twitter highlights, and became the new pinned message.
Let me clarify this re: the New Reddit page. Reddit does not allow the changing of a subReddit name, so it was not feasible to continue with the old Reddit due to their platform’s limitations. A link was left on the old page to redirect users to our New Reddit page. The links for Reddit were also updated on our website, Discord and Twitter bio.
Even after moving to the New Reddit page, our moderators continued to update the retired page as well, including the migration deadline, so this piece of information would not be missed in either case.
I will agree with you that it was a missed opportunity to tweet about the new Reddit page, in addition to updating the links and redirecting on the old one.
During this period, the Communications team, along with help from the other department officers in a team-wide collaborative effort, helped thousands of users manually migrate. I responded to every email received (email is linked on the website/dapp) with questions about the migration, rebranding, etc. We responded to every question or DM on Twitter regarding the migration. I responded to every DM on Discord asking about the migration. We worked without letup to try to inform and assist as many users as possible.
It is frustrating for me as well that not every member of our community checked in with us during that 4+ month period. I wish I could have just sent out an email blast or delivered snail mail to every holder; of course, this is not a feasible option in DeFi, but we made use of the tools that were available to us. Certainly I wish the viewership was even wider! I wish the community was more engaged and tuned in to the information we have been giving. We can only put out the information; it is up to the holders whether or not they pay attention, read and act accordingly.
I hope this clears up at least to some degree, the communications efforts that have been made surrounding the migration and rebranding.
Here’s about the only video I have just found when searching “how to redeem time wonderland”: Wonderland $TIME Down 100%!?!
by Bryan Talks Crypto.
Unfortunately his video only had 344 views!!
There was another video by “Jamie DeFi” some 3 months ago that got some 3900 views. However this was long before the manual migration situation and the subsequent End to manual migration. Time Wonderland update
The point is that these videos are efforts of NON-team members. Surely when being responsible for INVESTORS holdings around $100 MILLION it should not be left up to YouTubers etc to release videos.
(No disrespect intended to the two individuals who made these videos. I thank you for your efforts … though I did not see those videos “in TIME”.
Irrespective of any of these “communications” they are distributed across various “social media” networks. Like most people I have a life and it doesn’t revolve around spending my days on social media. There is work, family, kids, elderly parents, illnesses, deaths, marriages, involvement in community activities like facilitating kids play sport (as a coach or mentor).
I would think that the Italian version of Time (Volta) would respect ALL that is encompassed in living.
Oh, did I mention illnesses. Hmm, not like Covid-19 hasn’t been a huge consideration in the last 2-3 years. Is it not possible that perhaps wMEMO INVESTORS were “not paying attention” as they may have been sick, or caring for someone that has been sick.
does it even make sense to engage in close forum where team is gaslighting you(Owner/shareholder) into somehow believing that it is your fault that you did not know that WONDERLAND = NOW VOLTA
or about deadline, cause you did not FOLLOW NEW VOLTA Groups you did not know existed:)
People who technically u hired to help you run the project, NOT taking your direct feedback and admitting mistakes that you payer telling them they did, instead they ban and insult you?
and we are comparing how many posts team made, should it be 10 or 5, what is enough per month…
while a 100mil of value was appropriated from 60k people???
Now To the numbers!!!
Now, let’s summarize the total number of wMEMO token holders on all chains as you provided:
So you understand total number of once MEMO DAO Mambers/investors/shareholder would be GROUP A(those that converters) + GROUP B (those that did not)
Total Number of WMEMO Token Holders on All Chains:
WMEMO was a MULTI CHAIN TOKEN:
These numbers as of today, which will exclude some % people that were NOT AWARE = SOLD +were TOLD u SOL = SOLD
So Team Volta let 10% of people take funds from 90 % of people!
and we’re discussing cimentics… or being educated on how DAO should operate, that vote is vote… just to waste hours arguing with mods from oversees working for minimum wage?
Did you ever ask any of the investors, HOW ARE WE SERVING U? Is the treatment your’re getting what you signed up? Will you continue to invest with us?
The DNA of this Group is clearly something else…
My blood is boiling, and you will be burned by it…
Numbers are incorrect. You have to exclude dust across all chains, ftm, avax, ETH, arbitrum etc for all wMEMO tokens, and dust for time and memo on avax, you also have to exclude the blacklisted wallets, then you need to exclude all the tokens in the smart contract (as they are never accessible due to how smart contracts are), and obviously you need to exclude the treasury wallets across all 4/5 chains then the burned tokens need excluding, which at the end leaves your numbers at approx 3000 wallets. Not the number you propose here.
Please remember that blockchain sleuthing requires background facts, please stop making assumptions and trying to push your point with fiction.
And yet your response to the query by “07albi” in the comments to the CMP #1 “End of Manual Migrations” is NOT in the same sentiment at all.
It’s all about FEAR – “got hacked and their founder arrested”, “… custody of the Multichain wallet is uncertain”, “… so we had no choice but to close the automatic migrations …”.
Instead of all the rhetoric EVERY member of the team could have (should have) replied to the question posed that closing automatic migrations was necessary for risk management. Changing to manual migrations would mitigate that risk.
As NalX has now pointed out that you are a moderator, I’m even more curious why you were the only one to comment at length in that forum (on the CMP).
Now a few team members are commenting here to this NCV – why didn’t they comment to the CMP #1 to allay the FEAR created in that CMP?
As was stated in that CMP:
“Since that window closed the migrations are being done manually in a seemingly time consuming process that the team plans to keep open indefinitely.”
The last paragraph is all FEAR and one completely FALSE statement:
Let us move forwards and solve the security risks that are affecting us as long as any form of migration is offered.
Why did NO ONE from the TEAM refute these statements?
Surely if the team genuinely intended to keep manual migrations open indefinitely they knew there was NO risk doing it that way. They knew that manual migrations take time but it was the RIGHT THING to do.
The excuses keep coming … “we are stuck by the decision of the vote; we cannot go against the DAO” etc. However, there was NO attempt to explain (in the forum) very clearly that manual migrations did NOT pose a risk.
Who is Blatz?
Who is capable of sponsoring a vote? (How short is the list?)
2a. How BIG is their vote? (compared to the nearly 60,000 people not represented!!)
how many tokens in the smart contract?
Where IS INFO PUBLIC, where Was it ever public?
Why should anyone ever trust this team after you continue to like, like the most recent obvious lie about banner about volta on wmemo coinmarketcap?! which noone saw or cannot see.
why would i trust you about your about… figures that its 3000 wallets. u telling me that 3k from 60k wallets? is that what u’re telling me?
“-Had time to check on his investment
-Sees WMEMO down 90%
-Finds out it his investment wasn’t lost
-Now it’s worthless
-Blames the team”"
what is this childish gaslighting attempt? who are you to attack me, or tell me what I should do?
I technically SHOULD DO NOTHING, as its not NORMAL or EXPECTED to see your money STOLEN by FULL SUPERVISION OF TEAM that US VOUCHED TO PROTECT THE PROJECT AND INVESTTORS PUBLICLY…
WELL IT CANNOT BE BOTH… It cannot be A CONFIDENT TEAM that SERVES INVESTORS AND PROTECTES and WORKS TO PROMOTE AND INNOVATE AND MULTIPLY THEIR INVESTMENT AND THIS(TEAM THAT STOOD AND WATCHED THIS ROBERY GO DOWN) IT CANNOT!
yes I BLAME THE TEAM, to allow THEFT TO HAPPEN.
there is no LOGICAL Explanation for this at all. Ive heard all the arguments 45 times, consulted an attorney which laughed at it.
What is the purpose of the team, if IT IS UNABLE TO PROTECT INVESTORS!?
"Numbers are incorrect. You have to exclude dust across all chains, ftm, avax, ETH, arbitrum etc for all wMEMO tokens, and dust for time and memo on avax (the min requirement to migrate manually was $15), you also have to exclude the blacklisted wallets, then you need to exclude all the tokens in the smart contract (as they are never accessible due to how smart contracts are), and obviously you need to exclude the treasury wallets across all 4/5 chains then the burned tokens need excluding, which at the end leaves your numbers at approx 3000 wallets. Not the number you propose here.
Please remember that blockchain sleuthing requires background facts, please stop making assumptions and trying to push your point with fiction."
ok so…and feel free to correct me while im exposing your continuous lies, misinformation while being grossly negligent and incompetent.
THIS IS PAGE 120… X 25, u can see the rank.
Wallet that is RANKED 30,000 or 10X of your pathetic 3000 estimate
that wallet has 0.478 of WMEO * 330 VoLTA * 198 VOLTA PRICE on Jan 1, 2024 = $31,232
this is wallet 30 fucking thousand !!!
for the slow people in the class, this is 2,082 times higher than $15 minimum or dust, that all knowing(at least pretending) Admin [0xDjinn] refered to and wants us to belive.
STOP YOUR LIES!!! YOU ARE BEING EXPOSED!
p.s. explorer is buggy, take a bit more work… working on it will update this post! please hold your TROLLING HORSES.