The reality is we got to this point for multiple reason. One being our foundation was rushed and not solid enough. We focused on shipping without considering how we were shipping.
We need to build a strong foundation before we can go full throttle. Could we be building that foundation faster and maybe multitask ? Most likely, but I’d rather this than rushing it again and end up at the same spot in a few months.
The backing price and a RAGEQUIT option, needs to be removed to further this project, that is what attracted the whale attack on the treasury. If you look at the trades today, it is still going on, loads of people selling 20-50 time below backing, trying to reduce the price further, then to buy back at a lesser price, to gain even more of the treasury…
Its been a long time since a proposal was made, and RQ option was taken up:
The treasury has shrunk to about 280 million (without some of the BSGG), but its a large treasury.
The market has also fallen - and so has so many other backed DAOs.
Myself and Bastion are still looking at this with a lot of interest and with a lot things to do. There’s still some income to be made, and maybe a lot of fallen token prices, and new projects in just a tougher or what looks to be a tougher environment.
Let see! Hope we get a chance to get on WIP!
Hey! If you feel this is ready for the core team’s review/more forward, I would suggest incorporating/addressing some of the feedback received (looks like you already did most of it in the comments) and then submit (create a post) the WIP with the modifications.
Obviously, I can’t guarantee anything, but at least it will be in queue.
Absolutely NalX. Let me re-organize this as well on this matter. Its been a while and things changing through a long RQ process!
I’ve noticed SkyHopper has been active in the community ever since this proposal and I really enjoy the ideas and style of communication. I’m looking forward to Wonderland’s future. I see good things coming. I hope we can make some decisions as a DAO on individualized portions of Wonderland 2.0 and Professor’s ideas. I think it would be good to look at all of our options and be our best.
Very much appreciate your contribution and continued engagement @TheSkyHopper
Hi @TheSkyHopper I guess right now you are the only one who could possibly reach Dani when it comes to strategy moving forward. If that’s the case I really hope you can guide us all to what’s going on really here in the forum. Just bear in mind a lot of us not in discord and just in the forum. For me personally, I dont like discord due to the Sunday Market feeling. Anyway, I dont know what’s the deal are u at with Dani but if you are the closest to the (temporary/part-time, whatever) TM for wonderland, then I hope you can enlightened us the plan and timeline hopefully on:-
It would really be nice to hear some kinda plan on these. These 5 items i listed up there have become standard questions addressed to almost all good protocol out there. Thanks in advance.
Avax seems to have been mostly sold for RQ preparation.
Liquid staking on Avax can be potentially interesting, as the number of nodes we have can open up a few doors such as MEV attack strategies, or becoming Keepers - ofc we need to find some good partners for this part.
I don’t have a insight into Rebase, but honestly the rebase game is done for almost all of these Olympus Forks.
Buybacks (or with combination with inverse bonds) can be a great mechanism. If you look on Snowtrace, its evident that tokens are not being burned but just held in treasury.
If there is revenue share, I can see how there can be some locked staking through certain periods with boosters - but this would be a community decision.
What you want to notice is that there does seem to be a high number of addresses selling out completely, so I’m not sure they are all bots. But they may be arb bots. Ultimately, I notice that relatively large holders (“large but not really”), dump and then i am guessing market makers maybe are taking them on and selling out.
Sounds like a viable option for me. As Wonderland isnt progressing much we have to start somewhere an they seem experienced so Im all for it.
Some open progress on WIP Draft (I’m not done yet as I go to bed - such as fees, and longer term plan (or want to do) items not in yet).
Below:
Proposal for Treasury Management WIP
Name:
TheSkyHopper/Bastion to manage Wonderland Treasury.
Background:
Starting in mid-January a series of events had led to a point of a “restart” of Wonderland with a treasury war chest of 270 million US Dollars (as this is written), but with a vacancy of a Treasury Manager previously occupied by Sifu.
Proposal and Term of the Proposal
My proposal is to put to a vote to have me, (TheSkyHopper) and Bastion Trading to advise Dani and/or manage the treasury in line with asset protections such as multi-sig. The initial length of the first term is 3 months with a renewal proposal and vote in one month prior to the end of this 3 months term.
Objectives as Treasury Manager:
I am excited by the opportunity to work alongside Dani to deploy the treasury to set it on its path of sustainable growth of its funds. As we look to start a fresh chapter of Wonderland, I think it is important to start treasury management on a strong footing.
I am excited to be looking to work alongside Dani to deploy the Treasury to provide organic growth of the funds. As we look to start a fresh chapter of Wonderland, I think it is important to start the Treasury management on a strong footing, and overall weaponize all our assets - whether it is our massive Frog Nation community, relationships, and of course financial strength - to create amazing value accretion for WMEMO holders.
Background and High Level Details:
As a veteran of trading and managing portfolios in various markets professionally spanning 20 years and in crypto for nearly 5 years, I (with also the help of my team) would be able to manage the treasury. This management may take on many forms whether it is discussing with Dani the overall vision on the treasury, deploying capital for farms or otherwise, and finding other managers or personnel to help the treasury with multiple trading or investing strategies. Furthermore, I have a keen interest in setting the governance groundwork for sustainable treasury management for the long term and working constructively with governance improvement proposals.
My Opinion on Operational Level Strategy - Stabilization:
The first part of the treasury strategy.
Buybacks: Given the persistent market price of WMEMO below all metrics of backing price (liquid backing price and total backing price) is a tremendous opportunity for some level of buybacks, which at levels as I write (23,700-800 MIM per 1 WMEMO where the backing price is 35,000+ as liquid and 45,000+ as total) offers a material gain to buybacks and burned tokens. Additionally, a low backing creates the risk of hostile vampire attacks/takeover attempts. We would construct parameters for allowance for some treasury values to be used to achieve a balanced approach to buybacks. We would execute upon those plans.
Optimizing yield farming strategies:
A. In dollars: there is 9 million dollars' worth in USDT, over 110 Million MIM, 23 Million in WETH and even more tokens that are not being utilized in farms. We will look to deploy them, and find strategies to get MIM working in yield farms without selling the where the price is currently about 1 to 1.3% below the peg.
B. For tokens that have staking rewards, we can place them into staking nodes, or delegate them.
Re-establishment of a percentage into directional exposure – liquid portfolio strategy. Assets should be deployed into a collection of premier L1, L2 chains, gamefi/metaverse themed tokens – while searching for DeFi 2.0 themed tokens in my opinion. Recall, prior to RQ there was a material position in AVAX (via AVAX/MIM pool I think).
While this is out of my hands, I’d like to see if we continue to improve the Dao Fund page on the app – so to clearly explain the Treasury such as the proportion in Liquid Assets / Less Liquid Assets (think BSGG) / and SAFT exposure descriptions (Cross of Ages). Further, a unit tally of net outstanding TIME (or WMEMO equivalent) to further calculate value per token.
I estimate these activities likely will constitute the first 2 months of treasury management (including integration with the team).
To be continued…
Good start let`s get going !
this sounds great! we need to get this to a vote and elect them as new TM. we cant delay this further! lets go gents!
Buybacks need to be random and not advertised to prevent arbitrage. An issue we had previously so any automated buybacks I would be against.
It is almost urgent we fill the TM role, and I find your proposal interesting.
On the other hand, this is a huge position for our DAO, so everybody is afraid of making a poor choice of treasury management.
So we could do some AMAs to get our community onboard and give potential investors more confidence to get onboard again.
Also your idea of having like a team for the treasury management: excelent! Totally support you.
100% would want to hear from @TheSkyHopper on AMA. Thanks for brining this up. I hope it gets scheduled in a time zone when I’m able to join!
@jclemons I agree with you 500%! Any buybacks need to be entirely secret to stop manipulation.
I would like to mention to anyone else reading, protecting the multichain & leaving leadership in place was one of the first things that stood out to me about this proposal. Secondly the period of performance is also very telling. I think TheSkyHopper is simply here to help us get on our feet and take it from there. He is here laying it all on the table, offering his knowledge, skill and identity without direct control over the assets.
As a final say, Ser SkyHopper, I truly appreciate you engaging the community in Discord and being a Degen with the rest of us.
This RFC has my vote.
FULL SUBMITTED WIP BELOW:
To Frog Nation!
I write here to propose to become the next Treasury Manager (“TM”) of Wonderland for at least the next three months. The very least I’d like to help is set the Wonderland Treasury on a right path during my term if it proves to be so short. Of course, I’d be so honored if I could continue onwards and make this even more of the premier reserve backed DAO around. Admittedly, there are some big shoes to fill on the TM role.
Here are my previous RFC and Proposals below for your reference (to who me and my team are etc).
https://dao.wonderland.money/t/rfc-bastion-detailed-proposal-for-treasury-management/12453
Background:
Starting in mid-January a series of events had led to a point of a “restart” of Wonderland with a treasury war chest of 270 million US Dollars (as this is written), but with a vacancy of a Treasury Manager previously occupied by Sifu.
Proposal and Term of the Proposal
My proposal is to put to a vote to have me, (TheSkyHopper) and Bastion Trading to advise Dani and/or manage the treasury in line with asset protections such as multi-sig. The initial length of the first term is 3 months with a renewal proposal and vote in one month prior to the end of this 3 months term.
Objectives as Treasury Manager:
I am excited by the opportunity to work alongside Dani to deploy the treasury to set it on its path of sustainable growth of its funds. As we look to start a fresh chapter of Wonderland, I think it is important to start treasury management on a strong footing.
I am excited to be looking to work alongside Dani to deploy the Treasury to provide organic growth of the funds. As we look to start a fresh chapter of Wonderland, I think it is important to restart the Treasury management on a strong footing, and overall weaponize all our assets - whether it is our massive Frog Nation community, relationships, and of course financial strength - to create amazing value accretion for WMEMO holders.
Background and High Level Details:
As a veteran of trading and managing portfolios in various markets professionally spanning 20 years and in crypto for nearly 5 years, I (with also the help of my team) would be able to manage the treasury. This management may take on many forms whether it is discussing with Dani the overall vision on the treasury, deploying capital for farms or otherwise, and finding other managers or personnel to help the treasury with multiple trading or investing strategies. Furthermore, I have a keen interest in setting the governance groundwork for sustainable treasury management for the long term and working constructively with governance improvement proposals.
My Opinion on Operational Level Strategy - Stabilization: Low hanging fruit.
The first phase of the treasury strategy:
2. Optimizing yield farming strategies: In dollars: there is 9 million dollars’ worth in USDT, over 110 Million MIM, 23 Million in WETH and even more tokens that are not being utilized in farms. We will look to deploy them, and find strategies to get MIM working in yield farms without selling them in whole where the price is currently about 1 to 1.3% below the peg. Furthermore, for tokens that have staking rewards, we can place them into staking nodes, or delegate them.
3. Re-establishment of directional exposure: liquid portfolio strategy. Assets should be deployed into a collection of premier L1, L2 chains, gamefi/metaverse themed tokens – while searching for DeFi 2.0 themed tokens in my opinion.
4. Treasury Related User Interface (“UI”) and Experience ("UX) improvements: While this is out of my hands, I’d like to see if we continue to improve the DAO Fund page on the app – so to clearly explain the Treasury such as the proportion in Liquid Assets / Less Liquid Assets (think BSGG) / and SAFT exposure descriptions (Cross of Ages). Further, a unit tally of net outstanding TIME (or WMEMO equivalent) to further calculate value per token.
I estimate these activities likely will constitute the first 2 months of treasury management (including integration with the team).
Expansion Plans – Longer Term:
As a reserve currency protocol, we want to expand reserves, find partners to enhance the reserve currency operations, and increase the influence of the protocol.
5. VC type investments: such as SAFT agreements (seed pre-ico token deals), have played or playing a large role (BSGG, Cross of Ages) in both the value accretion of the treasury and certain opportunity to leverage the 80,000 hodler community. While Dani has brought deals, I think it makes sense to explore adding a dedicated New Project Analyst team to help screen, structure, and execute VC deals giving valuable headroom back to Dani and the team to keep building.
6. Manager Selection and Allocation Management: It will also make sense to add managers who have skills in different strategies. Immediately, I can think of trend following strategies to be potentially a great add for example. I would like to work on sustainable parameters and allocation rules for the DAO to allow for third party management as well.
7. Expanding and diversifying our DAO’s reach: as a reserve currency protocol’s ability to lend, influence, and borrow:
While having a super advantageous relationship with Abra and Popsicle, there is no downside to expanding other protocols that we can partner. Here, for example funding in/outflows may be able to be enhanced with borrowing or lending opportunities with protocols such as Truefi, Maple, and others.
Liquidity as a service, with the equity base, and strong DeFi capabilities along with a large community base, the Wonderland can provide an integrated service for other protocols for liquidity. A service on the “institutional” side is competitive with firms such as GSR, Jump, Amber, Wintermute etc. Our unique position allows us to play a little differently, or even in combination with them.
7. Governance around Treasury Management: Last but not least here on this list (which isn’t exhaustive btw) is that DAOs in general as a new type of institution needs to continually evolve. It embodies the spirit of democracy, but as we know, in practice this has been far from perfect in crypto as in the “real” world. As a reserve protocol, treasury management is a/the core function that needs to succeed within the DAO in the long run. A sustainable governance model must be always sought. Here, we’d have to look to overhaul voting timing, tightening and solidifying the proposal to WIP processes, and to create an active governance function (such as a board) over the Treasury Manager and the decision-making process. I look to collect as much feedback.
I know Wonderland 2.0 has some good proposals - and would like to work to help with any further formulation of those ideas and to help implement them (provided it passes of course). I would do this even if it means that doing so for a strong sustainable future may mean relinquishing my role at the end my proposed term (if I am voted in in the first place).
Fees
I have previously proposed fees of 2% of the staking revenues of the Wonderland for 5 weeks (1st month of management) - and mainly out of frustration (and cheap) nothing was done seemingly in Treasury. Anyways I honor this, and ask for the following fees:
1st Month: 2% of Staking Returns and paid in WMEMO, this may amount to very little but incentives me to quickly see that assets can be reasonably put to work in farms.
2nd Month: US $100,000 or roughly 0.0004% of liquid assets (this is 4x the MOD budget)
3rd Month: US $100,000 or roughly 0.0004% of liquid assets (this is 4x the MODs budget)
(I expect to re-assess and propose fee structure at every term re-election but If a WIP for re-election is NOT put forward, but for some unknown circumstance I have been still left beyond 3 months as Treasury manager I propose that the payment will increase to $200,000 monthly)
There’s been a lot of losses and I think it is important that we get a strong footing before negotiating higher fees. For this initial period, this comes out to be less than about 0.5% management fees, a quarter of the rate charged by Grayscale to just manage a pile of Bitcoin passively.
Requirements:
To fulfill this role, I would also need full support from Dani and the Wonderland leadership team as well – as this is essential to move things forward.
With the leadership, I’d also need to establish an agreement on the process of how to:
manage/advise on the treasury and movements
the extent I can represent Wonderland to external counterparties
communication with the community
involvement in UI improvement suggestions
Though the above is not exhaustive.
Voting Request
I would request to have a Snapshot Vote Duration to be 7 days. Provided the Snapshot passes, I would begin to engage Dani and his team on transitioning into the TM role and to negotiate the logistics of this transition. Afterwards, I envision that a strategy (possibly and hopefully crafted from the above) would also be announced as well.
Conclusion:
I hope this gives enough of an insight of what I am thinking, wanting, to implement as Treasury Manager and giving a transparent upfront ask on the compensation.
For other manager candidates that come by over time, I also hope that the format above may be to provide a framework for future proposals if nothing else.
Long Live The Frog Nation! LFG!
I would vote yes on this. I’d want to know if Dani and others would endorse as we need good chemistry in wl team.
Hey! WIP is indeed pending approval so, unsure who will approve it or tell us to approve it, but in the meantime I had a few comments:
There is big difference between managing the treasury and just being an advisor. Your first paragraph says you’d be the next TM, might want to clarify that section to make sure it’s clear what the proposal is for… TM or advisor.
For this I am just questioning the timing of the section vote. Is it because you consider that 2 months is enough for you to do all you need to do to show if you can manage this treasury or not ? The proposal is for you to manage for three months, but if that vote doesn’t pass after two months, do you keep going until the last month or do you stop there ? Might want to consider saying the third month would serve as a “transition” period if the renewal vote fails.
Unsure we still/ever considered ourselves a reserve currency, but that’s what the outdated documents say, so I guess it is what it is.
Maybe it’s just me, but can you clarify what you mean be staking returns ?
This hasn’t been voted on yet so you are essentially referring to a budget that does not exist.
Are you saying that you will not put up this request yourself and it is up to the DAO to renew your contract ? If you aren’t going to move it forward, there needs to be a way for the DAO or who ever to be able to negotiate these news fees. Since the vote is meant to happen 1 month before the end of your contract, this means those conversation/process to renew need to happen even earlier. Who would make those happen ? Dani ?
Same comment as before on manage/advise.
Hi:
Let me clarify to advise Dani and manage. Generally manage implies that anything between: I have the keys and I have full discretion on the treasury decisions.
On the term: I am aware also of Wonderland 2.0 Proposal as well - which if this passes - there would be a re-election process anyway - and the structure can possibly materially different.
You are correct here that this would be a “transition” period. The immediate issue is buyback policies as anything implemented now would benefit the protocol so quickly, and time may be of the essence. Income isn’t also being generated.
4x: Pending MOD Budget. But hell, if this doesn’t pass, like what? I’m going to work for the stingiest community ever?
I will absolutely put up a request and go through the process for a renewal. I don’t find it fair that anyone would get a longer tenure to manage if they don’t earn it along the way - but I do notice the Proposal/RFC/WIP process is quite long to implement, so I’m thinking of any way to prevent this limbo period.
What I can do here is edit and resubmit on some of these points.
I absolutely appreciate these constructive comments from you! Ace!